Server Help

[Jason]

First of all, I apologize if this is in the wrong forum. I wasn't quite sure where else to put it. That being said, it's high time I moved on to learning the language that everybody and their brother's brother is using to code their apps with these days. I feel as though I'm very comfortable in Java, and I'm ready to take the plunge into C++. My question is, where to start? Being that there are quite a few resident developers in here with mucho experience in C++ I figured this would be a good place to ask. I don't need to start out with one of those tutorials directed at someone who's never programmed a day in their life. However, I also don't want to start with something that's over my head. So what do you think? Are there any reccomendations as far as docs I should read? I don't mind spending oodles of time reading this and that as long as I'm going to learn something. I've searched around and found lots of C++ tutorials here and there, but I'm not sure of which to actually sit down and go through. And I can't seem to find any tutorials tailored to someone who already knows Java and wants to move over into C++.

Long story short, help me out oh wonderful gurus! :]

[Mine GO BOOM]

Since you already know a language, it isn't too hard to move over to another one. My recommendation: Get a good IDE (Visual Studios from Microsoft or if you don't have access to that, something free like Dev-C or Borland C++ Builder) in which you can use debuggers with. Helps a lot.

Start with some basic programs that you know work. Such as a bot for SubSpace. Load it up, and compile it without any changes. Look at how some of the parts work (such as the !help command), and try changing a bit. It shouldn't look too much different than how Java works for you. After a bit of playing with just simple parts, try figuring out how all of the dlls or the exe works.

Read some tutorials. As I don't/havn't in a while, I cannot recommend much more than what googling for c++ tutorial would return.

[Jason]

Thanks for the info. I didn't think this was Trash Talk worthy? No big deal though, they're your forums so you can move shit wherever you please.

That episode of The Simpsons is fucking great, by the way. :]

[50% Packetloss]

Pick up a good book. Find a book with the least amout of decorations on the front cover, take a look to see if it looks solid and then buy it. Online tutorials are nice, but a book is worth the money and will be handy for a reference.

[Mine GO BOOM]

[Gravitron]

If you wish I could fix you up with a nice small book - converted html that'll teach you most of the basics in C++.

[Helicon]

i have done this as well, though i didn't do it with a clear nkowledge of either language.

A few pointers to get you started:

Pointers:
Almost everything in java is By Reference (IE pointer-like), which most of C and C++ by value unless otherwise notated with a pointer
_________________
Signatures just seem so quaint.

[Jason]

MGB, thanks for the offer about the PDFs, but unfortunately I'm on dialup so 100megs is out of the question.

Gravitron, that sounds great! Whenever you get the chance, either PM me or send me an e-mail with more details.

Helicon, thanks!

[Cyan~Fire]

http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/

There's your basic C++ tutorial. Helicon's pdf, though, is really better if you're already comfortable with Java.
The only main difference between C++ and Java, as Helicon said something about, is memory management. Java will do everything for you there, but C++ you have to do everything yet it's much more flexible. The two major things to know are.
Declaring a variable with a * after the datatype declares that as a pointer. An & preceding a variable name returns the pointer to it's memory address. A * preceding a (pointer) variable name returns the value in that memory address.
A sample:

Code: Show/Hide int value; int *pointer = &value; //Now pointer is the memory address of value. value = 15; printf("Using value: %d\n", value); //printf() is like System.out.println() in Java. printf("Using pointer: %d\n"", *pointer); //%d in printf tells the program to display the value after the comma as a decimal (replacing the %d)

That should output:
"Using value: 15"
"Using pointer: 15"

OK, hope you understood that, I jumped around a little.
Your major resource here will be the MSDN library, which will either come with Visual Studio or you can get it on the web. I'd say first look up printf() in the library, as it's use is rather complex to most functions.
_________________
This help is informational only. No representation is made or warranty given as to its content. User assumes all risk of use. Cyan~Fire assumes no responsibility for any loss or delay resulting from such use.
Wise men STILL seek Him.

[Helicon]

oh yes, and java has a garbage collector. Once your vars go out of scope, they are deleted automagically.

in c++ , you have to trash your objects manually with delete.

if anybody has 100 megs (or less) of good material, please let me in on it. I do this often, and literature is always welcome on my hard drive.

[Helicon]

more junk:
this is not all 100% accurate, but it should help you find the floor to stand on

package == namespace

IE

Code: Show/Hide System.out.println("test");

~equals

Code: Show/Hide std::cout << "test" << std::endl;

note that std::endl is the end of line character and that
std is a namespace:
std::cout == System.out

header files might be a bit tougher to explain.
anyone up to it?

Blurb:
The fact is that C++ is often more lenient in how you get something done, and how it looks in text.
Stick to as many of your java habits as you can as far as syntax is concerned. Purists may look down on you, but the fact is that 50% more people can read code that looks like java, even if it is C++

[Helicon]

[Cyan~Fire]

Well namespaces and header files kind of combine to form packages.

In C++, to use built in functions, you include what are called 'header files'. It's like importing packages in Java. For example, printf() which I was talking about before is included in 'stdio.h'. You can include a file with: #include <headerfile>. For example, to include stdio.h, you'd use "#include <stdio.h>".

When you look up functions you want in the MSDN library (or any other one), it'll usually tell you which header file the function is included in.

Another word about dynamic memory:
Although C++ does make dynamic memory more complex, you have to use it a lot less. Classes in C++ are declared just like variables, without using the new operator.

[Jason]

I absolutely fucking love garbage collection. Memory management is what's kept me from picking up C++ for so long, although it's probably not that difficult at all and I just haven't bothered reading up on it enough.

Thanks Helicon and Cyan. I really appreciate all the various tidbits of info. Now I just have to start writing some of those basic, boring and generally useless programs one writes whilst learning a language!

[CypherJF]

i love c++, but ive begun to love java more because of the statements before, about how java handles memory much nicer, ie: garbage collection; it has a string class by default where in class we didnt need to write one up :X lol.. and in java we were taught how to make visual forms w/ it...

i know its possible w/ c++ but i guess im just biased on what i've been taught knowledge wise.. but in the long run c++, good stuff..
_________________
Performance is often the art of cheating carefully. - James Gosling

[Dr Brain]

C++ has garbage collectors too, they just aren't built in.
_________________
Hyperspace Owner

Smong> so long as 99% deaths feel lame it will always be hyperspace to me

[50% Packetloss]

just deallocate the memory you allocate. No need to have something do it for you, its simple

int *bob=new int;
delete bob;

[CypherJF]

yeah what about setting up a pointer to a variable; and if you delete the pointer and not the actual memory variable it was pointing too, it creates a memory leak that way?

[Cyan~Fire]

It's really just bad programming habits that cause memory leaks. As 50% said, if you delete your allocations, you're fine.

I personally like C++'s pointers better than Java's because it gives you more flexibility. (I know, I'm weird )

[Helicon]

[CypherJF]

i love pointers also; makes life a lot easier just its a pain sometimes when ur brain dies on ya and you are thinking it made a copy instead of a pointer :/ lol.. yea im just strange like that.. cause yea

[ExplodyThingy]

Java makes lazy coders, way too much possibility for failure. For example:
Bleh.toString().charAt(Bleh.toString().length()-1);

What if toString, charAt, or length() returned null? It would die, poor coding. In C, this is invalid
_________________
There are no stupid question, but there are many inquisitive idiots.
Loot

Dr Brain> I hate clean air and clean water. I'm a member of Evil Conservitive Industries

[Helicon]

[ExplodyThingy]

Well, that was just an absurd example. Fro my experiences in the world, you can tell who learned to programe from what. For the most part:
Lazy methods are done by those who learned on Java. Absurd methods are done by those who learned on PERL. Unnecessarily streamlined methods are done by those who learned on low level languages. Fast but often unexportable methods are written by those who learned on C/C++.

[Cyan~Fire]